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Feb. 21st, 2011 | 03:37 am
posted by: 4ashes4ashes in doomedtryst


For some reason, I get so nervous posting on LJ.

Anyway...

I've been a big fan of John/Sam since I first saw Doom, like, five years ago, but I haven't been very involved in the fan community. So, this is long overdue, but I did a sort of a shipper's analysis of John and Sam's scenes from the movie. It's like a watching of the movie with possible incest subtext in mind:

John/Sam in Doom

I'll warn you that it's kind of long because I'm long-winded it's aimed at readers that may or may not have seen the movie, but it does have lots of visual aids.

I'm so happy to see that this community is still active and productive!

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x4ashes4ashes

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from: 4ashes4ashes
date: Mar. 3rd, 2011 02:38 am (UTC)
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Thanks for checking it out! Yeah, it really is novel-length, isn't it? I'm glad you liked it.

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Poisoned Rationality

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from: chickybee32
date: Mar. 2nd, 2011 05:05 am (UTC)
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That was awesome! (Including the parts where I nearly spat out my coffee and the one part where I did end up snorting coffee through my nose).

You brought a few things that I hadn't really noticed and brought more depth to the bits I already had spotted. And then I popped Doom into the dvd drive on my pc & checked out some of the stuff you mentioned as I was reading.

I'm bookmarking this for future reference. FANTASTIC job!

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x4ashes4ashes

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from: 4ashes4ashes
date: Mar. 3rd, 2011 02:38 am (UTC)
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Thanks!!!!!! Having spent so long on it (and by how long it is, I'm sure you can tell it took me a while), it feels so good to get some positive feedback.

Sorry about the incident with the coffee... =)

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adorable, yet ill-adored

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from: ayrdaomei
date: May. 7th, 2011 09:42 pm (UTC)
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That was quite enjoyable! I can't tell you how nice it is to find other people who enjoy this movie as much as I do, and who also found John and Sam's dynamic so compelling!

Btw, the transportation device is "Ark" with a k, as in Noah's ark. I wouldn't have said anything except that your attention to detail is otherwise abundantly evident.

It’s never clear why he devolves into such an a$$, except that he’s trying to save himself at ANY cost.

You know, I initially wondered if the fact that he touched the infected blood that dripped through the airducts (and pretty much rubbed it into his fingers) had something to do with starting his descent into crazy. But most all of them came into contact with Goat's blood after he was attacked - noticibly Portman, and I don't notice that his behavior got any worse. Although I suppose you could argue that exposure came very soon after Goat was attacked, and the infection hadn't had the chance to spread through Goat's body yet.

I feel Destroyer's totally badass final battle with one of the creatures deserved a mention in his blurb :P I hated so much that Destroyer dies before Portman.

Adoti was born in Forest Gate which is apparently a part of London. So Rosamund's not alone ;)

So I don’t even mind too much when he asks Portman for a pill to help him “get his game face”. I don’t know what Portman gave him. Maybe it’s some drug of the future.

I assumed they were amphetamines (aka greenies) - thanks news coverage of drug issues in baseball - because of their color. Amphetamines reportedly boost confidence, alertness, sociability and focus. Admittedly, the kid didn't seem too focused in the sewers, but he was plenty social :P

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adorable, yet ill-adored

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from: ayrdaomei
date: May. 7th, 2011 09:45 pm (UTC)
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They’ve clearly seen each other at least once since they chose their divergent paths because Sam doesn’t like the way that John has changed due to the RRTS, and how would she know he’d changed unless she’d seen him?

Well, there is the yearly birthday card, you mention. So if you have a brother that you were close to in your youth, but he hasn't made any effort to see you or keep in touch with you other than the annual birthday card, I think you can tell that he's changed in someways, even if you haven't physically been in contact with him. Perhaps she's tried to reach out to him, and he's rebuffed those attempts.

If the word “Olduvai” sounds familiar to you, there’s a reason. Olduvai Gorge is an important archaeological site in Tanzania, sometimes called “the Cradle of Mankind”

I love that the writers put in those little touches. I just rewatched DOOM last night with my girlfriend, and she pointed out to me that Lucy was what some '70s archeologists named the oldest female set of bones discovered at the time ;)

By using “demon” in the singular, we can pretty safely assume that he is referring to Samantha. Particularly since she was the topic of the past sentence.

OK, OK: it’s possible that the demon is the accident, or Olduvai, but it makes a lot more sense if Samantha is the demon.


I assumed he was referring to Olduvai and everything it represents to him (which I suppose would include his current estrangement from his twin). But that's an interesting take and certainly one that gives you a lot to work with if you looking at the relationship with an incestuous slant. Interesting take.

Is it a coincidence that they’re sending her? Or maybe she requested the assignment…? (I like this idea) She has some familiarity with the lab complex, but at the same time, she didn’t know about the human tests (that resulted in this whole debacle), so she wasn’t necessarily the best choice for it. It could be possible that she was sent because she doesn’t have a family and it’s a dangerous job.

I vote for she volunteered. As you said, she wasn't surprised to see John there at all, and I can't imagine she wasn't told that she would be accompanied by the RRTS. I think she knew it was her chance to see John again.

The reason I’m taking so long in explaining all of this is because it’s extremely loaded but I don’t know how to describe it very well. Obviously.

**laughs** I thought you did rather well, actually.

protest one of two ways: 1) he doesn’t want her coming along for her own safety, or 2) he doesn’t want her coming along because he doesn’t want to deal with her.

I think it's both, but more #2.

Or he could be creating even more distance from her.

Distance, distance, distance! I also think he's got to figure she didn't luck into this assignment, and it's not a coincidence that she's the UAC rep coming with them. And if you figure he's been running from her all these years, perhaps even though he expected that he might see her on the mission, perhaps he didn't expect that the contact would be sustained

Oh, Sarge. This is not going to spoil your day. But your day is not going to be good.

Snerk.

Either he’s a sadist, or he’s being a good guy, and wants the two of them to work things out.

Given how much Sarge seems to know about John's personal life, the writers seemed to want to communicate to us that they are some kind of friends, not just unit-mates. So, at that point, Sarge was being a good guy. Probably his last good guy act in this movie ;) Put those crazy kids together and hope that John takes advantage of the opportunity to face those demons. Perhaps he figures when you work in a job that puts you in life-threatening situations day after day, it's probably best to have made your peace with those you'll leave behind.

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adorable, yet ill-adored

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from: ayrdaomei
date: May. 7th, 2011 09:46 pm (UTC)
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So, this dig found humanoid remains on MARS!!! and John didn’t know about it? Um…bullsh!t. As someone who had lived on Olduvai, I imagine he would follow news from there. But even if he avoided it, it still seems to me that major news like that would be known by everybody.

Well, only if UAC announced it. This is a privately funded dig, not research being done by any government agency. I actually don't think its all that unusually for archeological finds to take some time to be announced to the public at large, although I take your point that this is one hell of a find. Perhaps UAC was sitting on the news until they found some sort of way to profit from the 24th chromosome research.

He says: “They’re marines, Sam, not poets.” Not “we’re marines”, note.

I love that part! Because it says to me that the work was something to bury himself in, to try and put distance between himself and his past. But it's not who he is.

Saying “Sam” became second nature in this more relaxed context, where as he was very intent before when he called her “Samantha” and “Doctor”.

His defenses are coming down for sure. And in the context of his "they're marines" slip up, I also often wonder how much of the 'ttude before was for the benefit of his team. You know, to signal that she's an other, even to him; that he has much more in common with the other members of his military unit than this civilian brainiac doctor - even though that's not at all true.

What this argument reveals is that what they’re really fighting about is each others’ safety! He’s angry that she’s at Olduvai because it’s not safe. She’s angry that he’s a soldier because it’s not safe. These crazy kids! At least they’re fighting over something that’s worth it.

Indeed. That whole scene is one of my favorites in the movie.

If I won’t even go to another part of the country, I would NEVER go to Mars. I’m trying to stay close to my mother – I’m going to need her to babysit my children.

Snerk. I hope you got her a card for Mother's Day. Might as well start greasing the wheels early :P

John changes the subject: “If they were so smart, how come they’re so dead?” Good question, John.

That line makes me laugh every. single. time.

In fact, his lack of response is quite odd. I almost feel like something was cut. Or maybe he just can’t be bothered/isn’t bothered. Or maybe he’s already lost two arguments with Sam, and doesn’t want to lose another one, so he decides to not even get into it.

I always took his lack of response as an indication that on some level, it *does* bother him. Especially when you think ahead to the haunted way he tells her later that he's "done some terrible things." I always assumed he meant in the years he's spent with RRTS. So yeah, it does bother him, but of course he's not gonna give her the satisfaction of knowing it.

Sam asks for a med kit, and all I can think is that a little gauze isn’t going to fix what’s wrong with this man.

LOL, I know, right. That part aways cracks me up, because dude is bleeding from all over, and she's worried about gauzing over his ear.

This is total plot contrivance: Sarge never would have sent Duke with Sam for the reason I gave before.

**laughs** Or he knows Duke well enough to know that for all his talk, Duke's basically a good guy, and Duke, unlike John, is not going to leave a civilian scientist undefended after he's specifically been told to stay with her ;)

They find another scientist, who sticks a live mouse into his mouth, bites off the head, and eats it. Then John delivers another one my favorite lines: “OK…”. Never fails to amuse.

I love how John then proceeds to try to talk to the guy, like said guy's not clearly OUT OF HIS MIND.

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adorable, yet ill-adored

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from: ayrdaomei
date: May. 7th, 2011 09:47 pm (UTC)
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Where did John get all of this knowledge from? He gets him all hooked up to the machine, and Portman is putting in a line, and all sorts of techie stuff. Maybe it’s a future thing.

All the guys seemed to have some sense of what they were doing actually, so maybe they all receive some basic field medic training as part of their training for RRTS.

I don’t think anyone could look at that creature and then insult someone for considering the possibility that it’s an alien.

**laughs** Right? Her incredulous reaction to the suggestion that they're chasing aliens always makes me laugh considering that she knows there was extraterrestrial life on the planet at some point because they've found humanoid remains!

He calls Mac away from Pinky and sends him to check out one of the doors. This is probably the biggest mistake Sarge makes. Not only does Mac get killed almost right away, but one of the creatures manages to get through the Arc, and Mac might have stopped it.

That part always really annoys me as total plot contrivance, because I just can't rationalize it at all. There's even MORE reason for him to ensure that there's a soldier at the Ark at that point than there was when he left Mac there in the first place!

That line makes me laugh every time. Sarge’s expression, and the delivery are so genius. I don’t think it’s actually supposed to be funny. But I find it hilarious. Laugh out loud hilarious. Roll around on the floor, holding your stomach hilarious.

I can't remember the exact line, but I have a similiar reaction to Sarge's inquiry regarding WHOSE GODDAMN BLOOD IS ON THAT WINDOW.

And she’d just called him a wuss because he hadn’t wanted to do it. And not in a flirty-teasing way – in an actual emasculating way. And then she sort of notices him leaning in towards her, and she pulls away a little, in a “what the hell are you doing” sort of way. Without belaboring the point, she is not inclined towards him.

You know, while I would agree that she is not at all sexually inclined towards him, I thought the interaction was a little less frosty than your write-up suggests. I think she sized him up quick enough and realized that he was something of a teddy bear. A crass teddy bear, but a teddy bear nonetheless, and she lets her guard down a little.

Well, Duke has finally had enough of being indirectly insulted, and corrects her: It’s hoo-ah, he says. But I think he says it wrong, because it just doesn’t sound right. That’s kind of what I remember from aforementioned Black Hawk Down. On the other hand, if they’re marines, it ought to be oorah, or hoo-rah. With an “r”. Well, I’m not expert. But that’s my understanding. In fact, there’s a commercial for Jarhead on this very DVD, and Jamie Foxx clearly says that.

I've heard it both ways, and ol' mighty google says ....<href="http://usmilitary.about.com/od/jointservices/a/hooah.htm">that's actually accurate</a>. Alright then. Apparently some branches pronounce it without the R and the Marines pronounce it with the r, as you point out.

Why wouldn’t they experiment? In fact, I’m not even convinced what they did was so disgustingly wrong except that they probably weren’t ready for it, and it was probably illegal if they were keeping it a secret.

I got the illegal vibe myself. From what little I can make out of the expositiony video voice over, it sounds like the subject of the testing is a criminal who was condemned to life imprisonment, and while I suppose it's possible that he volunteered, I'd bet money he was conscripted into that experiment. And when you figure that five of the six doctors who were involved ended up turning Monster, that makes me even more suspicious about how on the up and up all the research and testing was. You know, in the Some People Will Do Anything For A Result.

Like that’s going to save her. He should have left her a flippin’ gun, am I right?

You are not wrong.

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adorable, yet ill-adored

last one :P

from: ayrdaomei
date: May. 7th, 2011 09:48 pm (UTC)
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One of the monsters was able to get through the Arc, so they’re clearly not dumb like zombies.

I think the extended fight Destroyer has with one of the creatures also shows that they have some intelligence, and they're not just creatures of brute strength and speed.

John gets knocked out by Pinky-the-monster (who is still attached to his wheel chair)

By the way, have you seen the trailer for Priest? I swear one of the creatures from that movie looks just like the creature Pinky turns into.

She opens her eyes a little, but doesn’t say or do anything except move her head a little further up towards his shoulder.

I love that whole last scene. Man alive, I wish this movie had made enough to give us the possibility of a sequel. I so want to know what becomes of them.

If you read this whole thing, or even just skimmed it, then I’m digitally hugging you right now.

**laughs** Well, I rather enjoyed it. While we see some things differently, it's nice to know there is someone else out there who enjoys this movie a hell of lot. Everyone I've watched it with always looks at me after like "...I can't believe you like that movie." :P

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x4ashes4ashes

Re: last one :P

from: 4ashes4ashes
date: May. 9th, 2011 05:50 pm (UTC)
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Wow, I can’t tell you how gratifying it is to hear back from someone who thoroughly read my entry. And to discuss the movie with someone who has thought so much about it!

I agree about Destroyer. His battle was intense, and he deserved more characterization, and to outlive Portman for sure.

That’s a cool factoid about Lucy! I found the Olduvai thing by looking it up, but I never figured the choice of “Lucy” had meaning as well.

Well, there is the yearly birthday card, you mention. So if you have a brother that you were close to in your youth, but he hasn't made any effort to see you or keep in touch with you other than the annual birthday card, I think you can tell that he's changed in someways, even if you haven't physically been in contact with him. Perhaps she's tried to reach out to him, and he's rebuffed those attempts.

Well, only if UAC announced it. This is a privately funded dig, not research being done by any government agency. I actually don't think its all that unusually for archeological finds to take some time to be announced to the public at large, although I take your point that this is one hell of a find. Perhaps UAC was sitting on the news until they found some sort of way to profit from the 24th chromosome research.

And in the context of his "they're marines" slip up, I also often wonder how much of the 'ttude before was for the benefit of his team. You know, to signal that she's an other, even to him; that he has much more in common with the other members of his military unit than this civilian brainiac doctor - even though that's not at all true.

I always took his lack of response as an indication that on some level, it *does* bother him. Especially when you think ahead to the haunted way he tells her later that he's "done some terrible things." I always assumed he meant in the years he's spent with RRTS. So yeah, it does bother him, but of course he's not gonna give her the satisfaction of knowing it.

These are all really great points and I agree. With regard to the last one, I'd never really thought about it that way, but I should have. It probably does bother him. He probably even regrets the choice that he's made.

You know, while I would agree that she is not at all sexually inclined towards him, I thought the interaction was a little less frosty than your write-up suggests. I think she sized him up quick enough and realized that he was something of a teddy bear. A crass teddy bear, but a teddy bear nonetheless, and she lets her guard down a little.

I know my John/Sam bias played largely into my interpretation of Sam's view of Duke. I set out to prove she wasn't interested and just went a little overboard. She definitely wasn't frosty towards him, and I think she probably did enjoy his company even though I made those jokes about her sending him away on purpose. You could see how relieved she was to have him there when they do get attacked. I like the teddy bear analysis.

I just went to check the trailer for Priest and you are so right. One of the monsters looks just like Pinky.

As much as I would love to see more of them interacting, I'm kind of glad there isn't a sequel so that it's left to my imagination.

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